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Ival
Advocate
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Posted: Fri Jan 18th, 2008 01:50 |
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Trevor ,
Am I correct in thinking this also explains how the antibiotic Rifampicin works in chronic Lyme. It modulates the VDR by way of the PXR causing an immunosuppressive affect. As long as they’re taking if they feel better but as soon as they stop they relapse.
I opened a bottle of wine and had a toast when I got through reading it just fascinating to see a disease process at the molecular level on paper congratulations
Ival
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MP 4/12/05/Benicar Q6h Ph1 4/26/05/ 25D13ngml 125D44pgml Ph2/6/1/05 Ph3/1/25/06 diag RA 2001 Male 47
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Dr Trevor Marshall
Research Team
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Posted: Fri Jan 18th, 2008 02:53 |
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Ival,
It certainly is an interesting possibility, isn't it Ival 
The effect would be different in chronic disease from what it is in TB.
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Dr Trevor Marshall
Research Team
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Posted: Fri Jan 18th, 2008 11:14 |
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The paper is now catalogued in PubMed, PMID: 18200565
http://tinyurl.com/ypk53t
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Russ
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Posted: Mon Jan 21st, 2008 07:40 |
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Dr Trevor Marshall wrote: I wonder how many other folk will notice that subtlety, and that Figure 1 talks about "energy" rather than solely "UVB"?
Does there have to be an external input of energy or does the body literally produce 1,25D all by itself? I'm thinking of a theoretical situation where a human is exposed to absolutely zero light of any kind (UVB, IR, visible, electromagnetic, etc.). Would you expect a human in this theoretical situation to still produce a sufficient amount of 1,25D?
Many congratulations on the paper. I look forward to the day when your work is fully recognized for the amazing discovery that it is.
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Lyme/Borrelia, Connective Tissue Disease | May '06: 1-25D=59 25D=30 | Jul '06: Phase 1 | Aug '06 25D=16 | Oct '06 25D=6 | Nov '06: Phase 2 | Jul '07: Phase 3 | covering up & wearing NOIRs | no other meds or supplements
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Dr Trevor Marshall
Research Team
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Posted: Mon Jan 21st, 2008 07:55 |
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Russ,
As far as we can tell, the body can produce all the 1,25-D it needs by itself. It upregulates keratinocyte production of 1,25-D in the presence of the inflammatory cytokine TNF-alpha, for example, and I suspect there are other mechanisms as well.
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Belinda
Research Team
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Posted: Mon Jan 21st, 2008 08:29 |
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A press release about the BioEssays paper is available online at
ttp://www.prweb.com/releases/2008/1/prweb639651.htm
We have a discussion of media coverage of the paper at Our Press Release Today January 21.
Belinda
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didierchretien
Member in Phase 2
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Posted: Mon Jan 21st, 2008 13:15 |
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Trevor,
When you talk about radiation, could it be that radio EM radiations like GSM, DCS, UMTS, BLUETOOTH, WIFI,...may fuel also these conversions?
I am asking this because I am working in a telecommunication company where everything is radio inside our building (LAN, phone, ...) since many years.
Even if it sounds crazy, the period when WIFI was introduced in our building and the more frequently usage of bluetooth devices correspond with an increase of my HypervitaminoseD symptoms. It is most probably a coincidence but...
Didier
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Sarcoidosis 25D10(Jan08) 25D6.9ng(May08) 25D7.1ng(July08) BeniFeb08 to wean prednisone Ph1Jun08 Ph2Jul08 Zolpidem Xyzall NoIRs low lux home limited outings covered
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Dr Trevor Marshall
Research Team
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Posted: Mon Jan 21st, 2008 14:26 |
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The lower frequency of these sources reduces their energy. Bluetooth is too low power to cause problems. Sources above 1 GHz and high power might be a possible problem. But I am talking about transmission tower power levels here, not WiFi wireless routers.
It is almost impossible to link symptoms with a cause. Just focus on recovery...
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migsies
Member in Phase 3
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Posted: Wed Jan 30th, 2008 16:25 |
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Reuters press release a couple of days ago:
"African immigrants with low levels of vitamin D are much more likely to be infected with tuberculosis"
"Their study of all 375 African immigrants treated at one Melbourne hospital showed that those who had low vitamin D levels were far more likely to have TB infections than those with adequate levels"
...so far, so good, and in clear agreement with Dr. Marshall's research.
But then they conclude with a serious lapse in critical thinking...
"Gibney's team said doctors might consider vitamin D supplements as a treatment for TB, or a way to prevent it."
(Not sure this is the right place for this post. Feel free to create a new thread if appropriate.)
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Sarcoidosis FM Lyme babesia 25D>7(Feb07) Ph1Aug05 Ph2Oct05 Ph3 Jun06 Valium Lyrica Ambien NoIRs limited outings covered Phase I 8/05, II 10/05, III 6/06.
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Dr Trevor Marshall
Research Team
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Posted: Wed Jan 30th, 2008 16:35 |
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Yes, this is the correct place. And yes, you are correctly identifying their lapse in thinking. The article is at URL
http://www.reuters.com/article/healthNews/idUSN2846942520080128
Maybe this line of thought was suggested by a peer-reviewer, and accepted in order to get the paper published, or maybe they had it in the back of their minds all along. I guess we shall never know unless somebody contacts the study authors, and draws their attention to the correct interpretation, the interpretation which was formed in the 1985 study of TB (my citation 67)(Don't you find it incredible that the authors were not aware of this paper? All it takes is Google or PubMed to find it...).
Maybe some of our Aussie mates could do some helpful follow-up here
Folk who live in underdeveloped nations are very likely to be carrying a heavy load of Th1 pathogens. Quite apart from their difficulty avoiding contact with nasty pathogens, the West has been exporting our Vitamin D fortified powdered milk and infant formula to these nations since the 1950s
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Grace
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Posted: Thu Jan 31st, 2008 00:09 |
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Gibney's contact info
http://www.journals.uchicago.edu/doi/abs/10.1086/525268
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CFS, oct04 Ds=26/48, 4/07=7/24 MP PHI 2/05, PhII 6/05, PhIII 6/06, beni Q6H, Noirs rarely inside no nature light low watt, outside 40%10%, Hat, all covered, no gloves, paracetamol
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Russ
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Posted: Sun Feb 3rd, 2008 03:56 |
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Dr Trevor Marshall wrote: I wonder how many other folk will notice that subtlety, and that Figure 1 talks about "energy" rather than solely "UVB"?
Since heat is energy (I think), is it possible that all forms of heat, and not just IR, can trigger the Vit D metabolism? Many TH1 folk complain of symptoms when they get overheated, even in cases where there is no high-energy IR source involved. For instance, if I go to sleep under too many covers and get real hot in the night, I will wake up feeling terrible. This is true even when the heat in my apartment is turned off. Is it possible that the overheating and the resultant heat energy is causing increased 1,25D or are symptoms like these more likely due to something else?
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Lyme/Borrelia, Connective Tissue Disease | May '06: 1-25D=59 25D=30 | Jul '06: Phase 1 | Aug '06 25D=16 | Oct '06 25D=6 | Nov '06: Phase 2 | Jul '07: Phase 3 | covering up & wearing NOIRs | no other meds or supplements
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Meg Mangin R.N.
Research Team
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Posted: Sun Feb 3rd, 2008 05:52 |
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"Humans perceive infrared radiation as "heat radiation", which is one way of energy transport. This may be why many persons with Th1 disease feel very uncomfortable when they get overheated." ..Trevor.. See Incident Radiation Tutorial
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Dr Trevor Marshall
Research Team
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Posted: Sun Feb 3rd, 2008 06:03 |
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An increase in body temperature can also increase the effect of antibiotics. Which might also make you feel less comfortable
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Russ
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Posted: Mon Feb 4th, 2008 17:22 |
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| I guess I was wondering which explanation was more likely the cause of the symptoms, since in one case (IR) you'd want to try hard to avoid it and in the other (increased abx effectiveness) it wouldn't be such a bad thing.
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Lyme/Borrelia, Connective Tissue Disease | May '06: 1-25D=59 25D=30 | Jul '06: Phase 1 | Aug '06 25D=16 | Oct '06 25D=6 | Nov '06: Phase 2 | Jul '07: Phase 3 | covering up & wearing NOIRs | no other meds or supplements
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Rico
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Posted: Tue Feb 5th, 2008 00:17 |
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Vitamin D deficiency paper is stirring up some debate:
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1960227/posts
http://tinyurl.com/39cttp
http://tinyurl.com/2v2w35
http://brain.hastypastry.net/forums/showthread.php?p=208026
http://www.her2support.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=150942
http://stopsarcoidosis.clinicahealth.com/comments.pl?sid=08/01/12/167232
I imagine there will be letters to the editor in the next edition or two...
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No diagnosis/some symptoms; wife with Sarc on MP; Olm 40mg q6h| avoid D| 1,25D=63 25D=32 (May 2006) 1,25D=44; 25D=10(Dec 2006)PhaseI(May06) PhaseII(Aug06) PhaseIII(Aug07)
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Dr Trevor Marshall
Research Team
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Posted: Tue Feb 5th, 2008 01:03 |
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Thanks Rico, I hadn't had time to go looking myself.
You know, one of the reasons I had to publish that paper was to draw a line in the sand that I had decoded the riddle of chronic disease, and to describe the processes in a way that they would be able to subjected to peer review.
In many ways, by trying to marginalize our thought, these folk are helping us immensely, as they are showing how radical our breakthrough has been. It is not an evolutionary improvement in knowledge, it is truly a break away from commonly accepted pragma.
There have been letters to the editor at BioEssays, and I have responded to one of them. It is tough to respond to letters where the writer, although well meaning, does not comprehend the concept of the VDR or gene expression, or indeed, even include it their in analysis
I have also had letters from Biologists that congratulated me on saying what had to be said. They themselves can now be more outspoken in the future, by citing my work.
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inge
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Posted: Tue Feb 5th, 2008 07:25 |
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Trevor,
I am thinking about writing a paper in a Norwegian medical journal on the vitamin d subject. In that regard, it would be helpful to have a reference to vitamin 25-D being an antagonist to the VDR. Do you have one at hand?
Inge
Last edited on Tue Feb 5th, 2008 07:25 by inge
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CFS/ME 125D64 25D12(dec 07) Ph1De06 daily lite exp NoIR use Ph2Mar07 ModPh2 Jun07 abx brkOct 07 r//t KFTs freq abx chg to control kidney IP Apr 08 phase 2 abx
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Dr Trevor Marshall
Research Team
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Posted: Tue Feb 5th, 2008 11:30 |
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Oh dear, Inge. That is a like asking me to prove water is wet. I just can't recall any single paper which shows that, as it is a pragma which forms the underpinning of all the drug discovery in Vitamin D analogs, and has been proven many, many times by individual drug discovery groups.
For example, this study:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10677578
and this one
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11179729
are typical of those in drug discovery exploring compounds which activate the VDR. 'Everybody knows' that 25-D is not one of them
I proved it for myself in two ways. They can be seen in my Karolinska presentation, and my Harvard presentation.
For Karolinska I provided the 2D plots of the amino acid residue interactions for 1,25-D 25-D and Olmesartan, while for Harvard I showed diagrams of how the Rat and Human VDR were activated - which residues were important. This was based on my own work, and a review of many papers in the literature. But note that by Harvard I had started to use the more accurate molecular dynamics simulations, which showed that Olmesartan actually changed the shape of the VDR a little from that of 1,25-D, so the key residues are a little different for that drug. There was no change between the 25-D and 1,25-D dynamic and static simulations, however. My paper on receptor modeling gives all the background on how one performs the 2D simulations.Marshall TG: VDR Nuclear Receptor Competence is the Key to Recovery from Chronic Inflammatory and Autoimmune Disease. Abstract presentation, Days of Molecular Medicine, Karolinska Institutet, Stockholm, May 2006.
Copy available from URL http://autoimmunityresearch.org/karolinska-handout.pdf
Marshall TG: Molecular Static and Dynamic Analyses Reveal Flaw in Murine Model used by US FDA to Detect Drug Carcinogenicity. Abstract presentation, Days of Molecular Medicine, Cambridge MA, May 22-24, 2007. doi:10.1038/npre.2007.52.1
Copy available from URL http://autoimmunityresearch.org/dmm2007/dmm2007-handout.pdf
Marshall TG: Molecular genomics offers new insight into the exact mechanism of action of common drugs - ARBs, Statins, and Corticosteroids. FDA CDER Visiting Professor presentation, FDA Biosciences Library, Accession QH447.M27 2006
Online Video available from URL http://autoimmunityresearch.org/fda-visiting-professor-7mar06.ram
Marshall TG, Lee RE, Marshall FE: Common angiotensin receptor blockers may directly modulate the immune system via VDR, PPAR and CCR2b. Theor Biol Med Model. 2006 Jan 10;3(1):1. Available from URL http://www.tbiomed.com/content/3/1/1
I hope that helps.
Last edited on Tue Feb 5th, 2008 11:32 by Dr Trevor Marshall
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inge
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Posted: Tue Feb 5th, 2008 11:59 |
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Thank you, that helps a lot!
Inge
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CFS/ME 125D64 25D12(dec 07) Ph1De06 daily lite exp NoIR use Ph2Mar07 ModPh2 Jun07 abx brkOct 07 r//t KFTs freq abx chg to control kidney IP Apr 08 phase 2 abx
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