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CFS, Migraines and the VDR
 Moderated by: Dr Trevor Marshall  

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Joyful
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 Posted: Sun Sep 6th, 2009 11:00

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This week I was reviewing an older article discussing some studies related to CFS and Migraines where 'genetic defects' were observed in the ion channel functions.

Knowing that in studies that note 'genetic defects' the researchers may be unaware that a dysfunctional VDR can be the source of the trouble, I asked Frans to take a look.

Frans responded with the following comments:
There are 3 things you could check in Wang's table 1. (See: Wang, et al., http://tinyurl.com/2v28tl.) This is always my first step, checking if VDR plays a role, and more often than not, it does
 
About the article:
1. There is mention of potassium channels playing a role, search table 1 with: Channel and you'll be amazed
 
2. there is also mention of the ABC transporters:  search table 1 with: ABC (the binding cassettes mentioned are also ABC transporters, in table 1, copy the Genesymbol, go to pubmed, change 'search pubmed' to 'search omim' OMIM is in the dropdown list and then paste the gene symbol)
 
3.  of course, when DeMeirleir is qouted, there is always talk of RNASE L, which can be found in table 4
 
It all almost screams VDR :-)
 
Frans
The article discussed is here: http://aboutmecfs.org/Rsrch/NeurologicalChannelopathy.aspx
Summary: Neurological diseases with channelopathies are quite often associated with fatigue and other symptoms common to CFS. Altered neurotransmitter activity and abnormal brain scan images in CFS have provided results consonant with Chaudhuri and Behan’s predictions. Indirect evidence of a channelopathy continues to grow in CFS but there is, as yet, however, no direct evidence of a nervous system channelopathy in CFS. The resolution of that question requires the kinds of studies suggested by Chaudhuri and Behan in 1999.

Last edited on Wed Sep 9th, 2009 12:32 by Joyful



____________________
Lyme?1980 Lyme/Babs/Bart?05 CFS?06 | Start 125D(50) 25D(32) Jun07 | Ph1Jul07 ModPh2Sep07 Ph2Feb08 Ph3Aug08 | Latest 25D(9) Apr09 | ABC of MP
jcocain
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 Posted: Sun Sep 6th, 2009 18:53

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Hi Joyful - I read the link you gave me and it does make sense about the neurological disconnect CFS patients have in their body's.  Unfortunately, no one has any real answers at this time to help people get healthy from the fatigue.

The table link within the article was not available so I couldn't review it to try and make more sense from research given.   If you have another link to it please send it over, it sounds interesting.

I guess the question is, will the MP help resolve the neurological disorders myself and so many others are experiencing?    

Thank you!  

JC



____________________
Lyme-10-yrs|MP P-1 1/10/07-P-3 9/17/07 Fatigue, muscle weakness,arthritis,brain fog,low thyroid,IBS, anemic,unrested sleep,low body temp,thirst| 1,25D=54 12/06 25D=35 2/7/07-vitD=31 6/07 VitD=17, 8/15/07 Vit-D 16.4 10/20/07 Vit.D 17.8,11/29/07 VD-13.5-12/
Joyful
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 Posted: Mon Sep 7th, 2009 02:05

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JC,

I think the theory here would be that since we know the MP addresses the dysfunction of the VDR directly, that resolution of this dysfunction will allow the body to recover from the fatigue --after-- the microbiota has been sufficiently reduced.

The evidence that this theory is likely to be correct is the clinical results for members with long standing ME/CFS who are now experiencing measurable recovery.

An example of someone who was essentially bed bound by ME/CFS for many, many years is Joyce Waterhouse. Her recovery is still not complete, but she is now able to travel (with care) and has been able to write and co-author articles and papers in the past few years.

However, as with many other symptoms, we often revisit the fatigue during periods of immunopathology.

In my case, I am having to learn to use the techniques learned by many other persons with ME/CFS to conserve my new found energy for healing and not use it all up in physical/mental activities. I think it is critical to do this, but we rebel with our whole being to this approach. We so long to be free to do whatever we please again.



____________________
Lyme?1980 Lyme/Babs/Bart?05 CFS?06 | Start 125D(50) 25D(32) Jun07 | Ph1Jul07 ModPh2Sep07 Ph2Feb08 Ph3Aug08 | Latest 25D(9) Apr09 | ABC of MP
eClaire
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 Posted: Tue Sep 8th, 2009 19:53

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Ah Joyful you are so right about our longing. Today, as I was lying in bed finding myself exhausted over my continuing exhaustion, I reflected back to last year at this time, and while functionally, I don't appear that much different, I feel measurably better. The better I feel is sort of like how someone who has been knocked down with a bad virus feels when the fever lifts. No energy, but you know you are on the mend.

It's the slowness of the progress that is getting to me, but then again I was getting no where fast (except closer to death) pre-MP.:)

Claire



____________________
34mo on MP; CFS FMS MCS COPD hypermob. IBS/GERD osteopor.; 125D48 25D<4;
NoIRs during most daylight outings & covered up; home w/o NoIRs
Ph1.Dec06 * ModPh2.Jun07 * AbxBrk.Mar-May08 * Ph2.Oct-Nov08 * Ph1.Jan2009
Lee
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 Posted: Wed Sep 9th, 2009 17:17

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Ladies, I started a new trick lately.  I lay in bed and extra 30 mins or longer upon wakening ...:D   I used to drag myself up immediately and start letting pups out and making tea.  Now the morns are a tad cooler, pups sleep in, I enjoy 30 mins of rest.  During this time I plot and plan how to conserve energy before my day begins!  It seems to be helping alot too!!  Lee



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2003 SARC w/COPD Hyper-Flex Fibro.
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DianeC
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 Posted: Wed Sep 9th, 2009 17:43

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Hi Lee:D,

That sounds like a wonderful idea and so healing to the mind and body.

I too find that by allowing my mind to fully become awake before rising has been very beneficial as well.

Pretty much as a rule if I get out of bed too quickly I will get the most horrendous cramp either in my feet, toes or calves. If I get one in my big toe it can be the most painful and is so weird as the toe will turn straight upward and this has lasted for as long as 11 minutes.   This has currently been my most painful IP symptom.

I have learned to always keep the heating pad by the bed and sometimes will lay there with the warm heat on my legs and feet to relax them before rising.  It has made a world of difference.  The fact that we had a cooler summer was also beneficial.

I have also learned to limit the stretching before waking that is so tempting to do for that alone can prompt a cramp and then I will wait to put the socks on until I have walked around a bit.    

And yes Lee, this is the perfect time to plan the day and conserve energy as you have suggested!:D

Diane

  



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chronic fatigue/osteoporosis osteoarthritis, 9/05 25-D 40 1,25-D 52 1/06 Benicar 40mg Q6H Mino 28Jan @25mg q48h Mino 12Mar @50mg q72h Mino 15April @75mg q72h Mino 1May 100mg 5/06 Phase 2 D-25 18 10/06 Phase3 D-25 20 5/07 D-25 under 7
Dogster
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 Posted: Fri Sep 11th, 2009 19:41

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Many  long-time lymies/cfsers note peculiarly that they feel better but still dont funtion better.  Same is true for me after 4 years and 4 months.  Like many i have more "quality of life in the house" (i saw this phrase in someone's thread) type of thing.  But still can do no exertion, go out much, etc. 

 I seem to have two sets of restrictions that i cant push--one is exertion and the other is particulates.  Even tiny exposure to particulates, such as dusting the furniture, leads rapidly  to migraine onset. So do outside activities(where particulates are abundant in my part of country) or just driving the car beyond  so many minutes.  It's as if the membranes in the eyes and nose etc are too damaged to heal, or at least so far havent.  Last time my doc looked at my ever inflamed upper respiratory tract and said "can you move to one of the coasts?"

I sleep well but it is  10 hours a day, and am horizontal many hours other than that.  My body still prefers being horizontal or reclining to upright.  Anytime i overdo it, my body has to get horizontal, sleeping or just resting, to recover. The recovery can be hours, day or even weeks.

I do still see improvement but it is by the year, not season.  I think of how i felt a year ago in the same season.  Its nice to feel better in the house but these two parameters of exertion and particulates are very rigid and beginning to feel like bars.  Have some more thoughts but have to go now.  All for now, Dogster

 

  



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CFS lyme RSD: pain migraine| tylenol fioricet flexeril tramadol temazepam| acidoph guaif/cold| Q| Cut D/exp Feb05| NoIR Mar05| June05 Comm Beni Q8H| July05 mino| Jan06 PH2| Aug06 1,25D=29 25D=17|
Joyful
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 Posted: Tue Sep 15th, 2009 08:27

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Another recent paper discussing gene expression differences between healthy controls and patients with ME/CFS and/or FM...
Moderate Exercise Increases Expression for Sensory, Adrenergic, and Immune Genes in Chronic Fatigue Syndrome Patients But Not in Normal Subjects.

J Pain. 2009 Jul 30. [Epub ahead of print]

Light AR, White AT, Hughen RW, Light KC.

Department of Anesthesiology, Utah, University of Utah Salt Lake City, Utah;
Department of Exercise and Sport Science, University of Utah Salt Lake City, Utah
Department of Neurobiology and Anatomy, University of Utah Salt Lake City, Utah

Chronic fatigue syndrome (CFS) is characterized by debilitating fatigue, often accompanied by widespread muscle pain that meets criteria for fibromyalgia syndrome (FMS). Symptoms become markedly worse after exercise. Previous studies implicated dysregulation of the sympathetic nervous system (SNS), and immune system (IS) in CFS and FMS. We recently demonstrated that acid sensing ion channel (probably ASIC3), purinergic type 2X receptors (probably P2X4 and P2X5) and the transient receptor potential vanilloid type 1 (TRPV1) are molecular receptors in mouse sensory neurons detecting metabolites that cause acute muscle pain and possibly muscle fatigue. These molecular receptors are found on human leukocytes along with SNS and IS genes. Real-time, quantitative PCR showed that 19 CFS patients had lower expression of beta-2 adrenergic receptors but otherwise did not differ from 16 control subjects before exercise. After a sustained moderate exercise test, CFS patients showed greater increases than control subjects in gene expression for metabolite detecting receptors ASIC3, P2X4, and P2X5, for SNS receptors alpha-2A, beta-1, beta-2, and COMT and IS genes for IL10 and TLR4 lasting from 0.5 to 48 hours (P < .05). These increases were also seen in the CFS subgroup with comorbid FMS and were highly correlated with symptoms of physical fatigue, mental fatigue, and pain. These new findings suggest dysregulation of metabolite detecting receptors as well as SNS and IS in CFS and CFS-FMS. PERSPECTIVE: Muscle fatigue and pain are major symptoms of CFS. After moderate exercise, CFS and CFS-FMS patients show enhanced gene expression for receptors detecting muscle metabolites and for SNS and IS, which correlate with these symptoms. These findings suggest possible new causes, points for intervention, and objective biomarkers for these disorders.
PMID: 19647494 [PubMed - as supplied by publisher]
It seems significant to me that the aberrant expression was for receptors on the white blood cells (leukocytes).

Last edited on Tue Sep 15th, 2009 08:33 by Joyful



____________________
Lyme?1980 Lyme/Babs/Bart?05 CFS?06 | Start 125D(50) 25D(32) Jun07 | Ph1Jul07 ModPh2Sep07 Ph2Feb08 Ph3Aug08 | Latest 25D(9) Apr09 | ABC of MP
eClaire
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 Posted: Tue Sep 15th, 2009 08:44

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Joyful, I saw that study and thought the same thing. Am I remembering correctly that those are the cells that are specifically targeted by CWD to aid them in eluding the innate immune system? I wonder what this means.... Claire



____________________
34mo on MP; CFS FMS MCS COPD hypermob. IBS/GERD osteopor.; 125D48 25D<4;
NoIRs during most daylight outings & covered up; home w/o NoIRs
Ph1.Dec06 * ModPh2.Jun07 * AbxBrk.Mar-May08 * Ph2.Oct-Nov08 * Ph1.Jan2009
laura1814
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 Posted: Thu Oct 1st, 2009 22:47

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Joyful wrote: In my case, I am having to learn to use the techniques learned by many other persons with ME/CFS to conserve my new found energy for healing and not use it all up in physical/mental activities. I think it is critical to do this, but we rebel with our whole being to this approach. We so long to be free to do whatever we please again.
I really like how you put this.  I think I may even print it out and put it up on my wall to remind me.  :)



____________________
CFS, EBV, PCOS, POF, TMJ, hypoglycemia, hyperlipidemia, MP Ph1 1/08, Ph2 4/08, Ph3 1/09; enzymes, & ranitidine PRN, NoIRs, low lux home, limited outings, covered up, 1,25D=37, 25D=9.

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