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The Obesity Era
 Moderated by: Prof Trevor Marshall Page:  First Page Previous Page  1  2  3  Next Page Last Page  
 

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Cynthia S
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 Posted: Thu Oct 10th, 2013 08:20

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Sunset, I totally disagree with you.  But let me preface my beliefs with the caveat that my beliefs may not be any more correct than yours.  I believe that a properly functioning body needs very little in the way of nutrition.  Look how young people can eat so badly and they do so well.  The difference is that they have far less CWD bacteria, virus, and fungi infection in their cells.  Their bodies function better than ours.

I am reminded that the early Eskimos ate no carbohydrates, almost no vitamin c. and did not come down with scurvy.  Compare this to the proponents that argue we ate tons of fruit in our early existence, and a normal amount (need) of vit C was many grams.  Changing one's food intake to up the nutritional value or lower the bad stuff has never cured anyone of anything, but may have reduced symptoms.  This from my near life long study of health foods and alternative medicine.  People still die of old age diseases.  In my own case, I personally blame my pursuit of health as a cause of my chronic disease happening sooner and with a vengeance.

Obesity, in my opinion, is just an early symptom of TH1 disease, caused by the infection of the many TH1 organism.  And of course, other TH1 disease symptoms are going to follow by the nature of the continued growth of the organisms.

 Cynthia



____________________
MP start 10/08,break 1/16 - 9/16, Spondylitis'97,early Diverticulosis'98,early AMD'08,Calcium anomaly'95,TypeII Diabetes(?)'02,Degenerative hip disease'12, 25D=10.8 May'18 (preMP 125D/25D=47/43) https://marshallprotocol.com/forum30/13911-2.html
Teresa Green
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 Posted: Sun Oct 20th, 2013 20:59

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Team,

This is a valuable TED talk that questions the current paradigm that type 2 diabetes is as a result of obesity.  It questions the scientific dogma of simple cause and effect.   Maybe someone could e-mail Peter Attia to point out to him the possibility of a pathogenic cause:

http://www.ted.com/talks/peter_attia_what_if_we_re_wrong_about_diabetes.html

Regards

Teresa Green

Cynthia S
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 Posted: Mon Oct 21st, 2013 07:19

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Great talk.

OK, I have sent a message thru his CONTACT link.



____________________
MP start 10/08,break 1/16 - 9/16, Spondylitis'97,early Diverticulosis'98,early AMD'08,Calcium anomaly'95,TypeII Diabetes(?)'02,Degenerative hip disease'12, 25D=10.8 May'18 (preMP 125D/25D=47/43) https://marshallprotocol.com/forum30/13911-2.html
TP
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 Posted: Sun Oct 27th, 2013 10:30

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I, too, have been a student of Drs. Paul Eck, Dave Watts, and Larry Wilson. I've been on the supplements suggested by my TMA for about 35 years. I find them a great addition to the MP.

Claudia
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 Posted: Mon Oct 28th, 2013 16:16

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Hold on to your hats. Here's something making the rounds on the internet now - promoting chlorogenic acid as a weight-loss miracle!

http://greencoffees-fast-fatburn.com/?43/3

Note they emphasize that it is "natural" and "safe"!

I can hardly wait for the combined Vitamin D + Chlorogenic acid pills to appear...
"NEW! Slow-acting, Safe, Natural Suicide Pills!"
Buy the family sized bottle and save...
:shock:



____________________
MP Phase1 23Mar_06; Phase2 July 10_06; Phase3 Nov 4_06. Dx Thyroiditis (Thyroxine); arthritis; glaucoma; CFS (1988-92);Kidney & bladder probs., Osteoporosis Dx 2015, Burning Mouth Syndrome! 2016. Feb06 1,25D=43.3; Aug07 1,25D=27.5; Feb06 25D=44; Mar08
wrotek
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 Posted: Tue Oct 29th, 2013 00:43

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LOL chlorogenic acid promoting weight loss ? Check this out
http://www.firstpost.com/living/drinking-5-cups-of-coffee-everyday-may-lead-to-obesity-study-816431.html

http://digitaljournal.com/article/350865

Dr. Vinson believes that chlorogenic acid inhibits the release of glucose into the blood stream. The cycle is that when glucose enters the human bloodstream after consuming food or beverage, the liver releases insulin. The insulin stores the excess glucose as fat. By slowing down the absorption of glucose in the bloodstream, the chlorogenic acid thus reduces the absorption of fat. And, it is believed to cause the liver to metabolize the fat faster.


Last edited on Tue Oct 29th, 2013 00:44 by wrotek



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keithw
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 Posted: Thu Oct 31st, 2013 14:16

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This aired last night over here, http://www.abc.net.au/iview/#/view/76561613

Not sure how long it will be available but you should be able to save the link.

:dude:



____________________
WeanPred May09 no breaks SLE, CNS vasculitis, avascular necrosis, arthritis both shoulders Ph1Aug09 Ph2Nov09 Ph3Feb10 25D35(May09)18(Mar10)16.7(Jul10)13.6(Jan11)13.2 (Oct 11)14.8(Aug 12) around 35(Jul14)due to weight loss!
Ron
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 Posted: Thu Oct 31st, 2013 14:38

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http://www.abc.net.au/catalyst/heartofthematter/

"Heart of the Matter Part 2 - Cholesterol Drug War"

:)

Cairo123
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 Posted: Fri Nov 1st, 2013 10:17

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Bacteria and Fat: A 'Perfect Storm' for Inflammation

Oct. 30, 2013 — Making fat cells immortal might seem like a bad idea to most people, but for a team of University of Iowa scientists it was the ideal way to study how the interaction between bacteria and fat cells might contribute to diabetes.

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/10/131030185153.htm?

Last edited on Fri Nov 1st, 2013 10:17 by Cairo123



____________________
Sarcoidosis, Arthritis, Fallen Arch, Vascular Insufficiency, fatty liver,diverticulosis, 1,25D 16 (Oct08) | Ph1 Nov07, Ph2 Jan08, Ph3 May 09 Ben Only: Jun 10- Sep 10|Break Sep 10-Dec 10|Resume MP Dec 10|
GillyB
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 Posted: Fri Nov 1st, 2013 11:38

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So, why are these guys not following the thread back to the bacteria, that produce the toxins, that create the inflammation, that leads to diabetes? Do they assume there's no getting rid of the bacteria, so it's better to interrupt the process at some other stage?

It's so frustrating to see so many get so close, yet never quite make the connection.



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MP start Jun'12, once again on an MP break | Degenerative Disc Disease, Osteoarthritis, Post-Lyme, depression/anxiety, GI. Most recent serum 25D: 6/15 -18
Carry on, and keep MP'ing
Ralph
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 Posted: Sat Nov 2nd, 2013 16:51

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Hi All,

Having seen both episodes of the catalyst program It has just confirmed what we all believe about the science world. Its not about better patient outcomes. Its about making $$$$.

For me who has had a very high cholesterol marker since I started the MP confirms my decision to stay off the Statins. Even though I have been pounded by my Doc and Cardiologist to go on the Statins. I can tell you its not been easy not to take the plunge . Only last month my Cardiologist again was pushing for the Statin. I owe Trevor my gratitude as he has also pounded me over the years to leave it alone. :)

It has been good to see a media outlet actual run a storey challenging the science of Statins. We need more of these guys to bring the true science to the public arena. What about the Vit D findings from the Lancet recently. To bad that finding has not found media outlets to let the public know. It couldn't be because there is so much money to be made on Vit D Pill taking :X.

Some of the interviewees correctly have stated that to try and change this culture will take a long time. Have we heard this before...god bless you Trevor your pulse is on the true science data.

Cheers,

Ralph



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Diagnosis Lung/sarc 1/3/05 Phase 3/4 Vit D -17 April 2016 / Cholesterol 6.5 mmol/L ,Meds Benicar q6h , Struggling now with Hashimoto's,Dieting Accordingly, Off Armour Thyroid
Cairo123
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 Posted: Sat Nov 2nd, 2013 19:49

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Money talks. Follow the money.



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Sarcoidosis, Arthritis, Fallen Arch, Vascular Insufficiency, fatty liver,diverticulosis, 1,25D 16 (Oct08) | Ph1 Nov07, Ph2 Jan08, Ph3 May 09 Ben Only: Jun 10- Sep 10|Break Sep 10-Dec 10|Resume MP Dec 10|
Claudia
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 Posted: Sat Nov 2nd, 2013 20:34

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I think it's also the MDs' fault... they are either overworked or lazy or both. They think it's good enough to get their info from drug company reps and when we (patients) try to talk to them about alternatives, they roll their eyes and make patronizing remarks like, "Oh, so you've been visiting Dr Google again?"
argh! :X



____________________
MP Phase1 23Mar_06; Phase2 July 10_06; Phase3 Nov 4_06. Dx Thyroiditis (Thyroxine); arthritis; glaucoma; CFS (1988-92);Kidney & bladder probs., Osteoporosis Dx 2015, Burning Mouth Syndrome! 2016. Feb06 1,25D=43.3; Aug07 1,25D=27.5; Feb06 25D=44; Mar08
Prof Trevor Marshall
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 Posted: Sat Nov 2nd, 2013 20:45

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The press in Oz are really giving ABC a hard time!
I looked over both the programs in detail. ABC sought out competent experts, and presented both sides of the argument. Beatrice Golomb, for example, has spent much of her career studying statin side effects. I have personally discussed this issue with her. She knows the topic inside out.

I think the problem was that the science came out as being extremely one-sided. The lack of scientific support for the cholesterol dogma is the problem the cholesterol folk ought to be addressing, not ABC's reporting.

But the Business of Medicine is a really big business, and has performed well in delivering promises, while hiding failures behind a veneer of respectability. Just as the ABC demonstrated, many of the studies performed these days are really not worth the paper they are printed on. Drugs are commonly approved with a 16% improvement in a single biomarker. What use is this measure to a patient threatened by a deadly disease? Why don't they measure the patient's actual response, rather than the easier biomarker? Why are life extensions for cancer patients measured in months, not years? However, one day the public will figure it out. If not on this issue, maybe on the next...

There is another destructive dynamic too. And that is that many physicians feel quite desperate these days, especially when cardiovascular disease (CVD) or cancers are involved. They see their patients die. They know they have done all they could to help them, but there really are no fully-effective drugs in their arsenal right now. I have had Doctors say to me "But hang it all - I had to prescribe something for my patient - something which might help."

There are no easy answers. Thirty years ago PhRMA made a pact with the public - "put lots of money into research and when you grow old we will have the drugs ready for your needs." The money has been invested, and has produced essentially no results. We have nothing to cure cancers, nothing to cure CVD, nothing even to deal (long term) with arthritis or fibromyalgia. It is a sad state of affairs, and one which will only begin to resolve itself if more journalists take the initiative to alert the public to the bleak future mankind faces on its current trajectory...

LR
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 Posted: Thu Nov 7th, 2013 09:49

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I am surprised that people on MP are surprised that bacteria are implicated in obesity.

I thought it was a fairly common experience among those on MP to have their weight normalize. Those overweight finding their weights tending more toward weight loss and those underweight tending toward gaining weight.

My weight did not change much but I was fairly normal weight to begin with. My daughter had tried and failed to lose weight previously except on one extreme diet that scared her when she lost so much weight that she gained a fair bit back immediately. But after starting MP, she started getting fevers and chills and arthritic symptoms AND losing weight slowly but surely. I don't know if it was the fevers that were melting off the fat, but I understood from others that it was the die off of bacteria that cause obesity. Once she realized that she COULD lose weight, she started to cooperate with the process -- not with an extreme diet, but just watching what she ate a little better and observing portion size a little more. She lost about 40 or 50 pounds over about 2 - 3 years and kept it off without much difficulty until she was forced to go onto prednisone recently.

The reason I am surprised by the surprise of other MPers is that it was the ONLY health issue my daughter or I had that RESOLVED on the MP. At the time, other people posted similar results, so I thought it was well accepted by MP that MP tended to help resolve weight in the direction of normal, and that it appeared to do so by killing off the bacteria causing obesity.
LR



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MP:Jun7 08; Ph3-Aug09; Olmetec only- Feb11; DXs:Envir.sens; chronic fatigue, celiac, kidney failure, osteoporosis, calcified low thyroid,uterine fibroids, extreme low magnesium/B-12 etc. Jan07 D= 20.8 1,25D=75; May 2007 D=15.6; 1,25 D=52.9;Jun2011 D=5.6 1
keithw
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 Posted: Thu Nov 7th, 2013 13:24

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Nothing much surprises me about MP these days, when you come to terms with the knowledge that all life is built from bacteria then it follows that we are all a product of the environment.

I wouldn't mind dropping weight a little faster and losing the lovehandles but we live in a society which promotes snacking and there is such a high volume of junk food available that even when you try hard to avoid it you get caught.

With improved recovery comes socialising and that means cuppas and biscuits, before you know it you are dining out with friends and reintroduced to the bacterial mix as well as peer pressure that tells you to eat up.

It seems that in certain ways I am getting my life back but with knowledge gained here I don't want it as it was as I don't want to have to do this again.
Where to go next?:?

BTW, Catalyst this week was about anti aging products which isn't relevant to this topic but those who want to follow the series can see it here: http://www.abc.net.au/catalyst/stories/by-date/2013/

:dude:



____________________
WeanPred May09 no breaks SLE, CNS vasculitis, avascular necrosis, arthritis both shoulders Ph1Aug09 Ph2Nov09 Ph3Feb10 25D35(May09)18(Mar10)16.7(Jul10)13.6(Jan11)13.2 (Oct 11)14.8(Aug 12) around 35(Jul14)due to weight loss!
Cynthia S
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 Posted: Thu Nov 7th, 2013 20:12

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Early in the MP, many of us either gain weight, or lose weight. I gained about 25-30 pounds very gradually on the MP, kept it there for a few years, and now, at 5 years, that weight has started to come down.

Someone once referred to fat being part of the immune system. Wish I knew what they meant by that.

Cynthia

Edit:  Almost a year later, hadn't gone down much, and it started to go up again!

Last edited on Sat Nov 29th, 2014 13:02 by Cynthia S



____________________
MP start 10/08,break 1/16 - 9/16, Spondylitis'97,early Diverticulosis'98,early AMD'08,Calcium anomaly'95,TypeII Diabetes(?)'02,Degenerative hip disease'12, 25D=10.8 May'18 (preMP 125D/25D=47/43) https://marshallprotocol.com/forum30/13911-2.html
Cairo123
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 Posted: Sat Jan 4th, 2014 08:23

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More Evidence Suggests Type 2 Diabetes Is Inflammatory Disease

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2014/01/140102123401.htm?

As people's waistlines increase, so does the incidence of type 2 diabetes. Now scientists have a better understanding of exactly what happens in the body that leads up to type 2 diabetes, and what likely causes some of the complications related to the disease. Specifically, scientists from Denmark have found that in mice, macrophages, a specific type of immune cell, invade the diabetic pancreatic tissue during the early stages of the disease. Then, these inflammatory cells produce a large amount of pro-inflammatory proteins, called cytokines, which directly contribute to the elimination of insulin-producing beta cells in the pancreas, resulting in diabetes. This discovery was published in the January 2014 issue of the Journal of Leukocyte Biology

I wonder if they considered the possibility that the macrophages were going after something such as pathogens.

Last edited on Sat Jan 4th, 2014 08:24 by Cairo123



____________________
Sarcoidosis, Arthritis, Fallen Arch, Vascular Insufficiency, fatty liver,diverticulosis, 1,25D 16 (Oct08) | Ph1 Nov07, Ph2 Jan08, Ph3 May 09 Ben Only: Jun 10- Sep 10|Break Sep 10-Dec 10|Resume MP Dec 10|
Prof Trevor Marshall
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 Posted: Sat Jan 4th, 2014 08:32

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I wonder if they considered the possibility that the macrophages were going after something such as pathogens?

No, they don't consider that because their physician-mentors have told them that the body is sterile. If there were any pathogens present, they would obviously have been wiped out by antibiotics :)

Yet the biologists inject Streptozotocin into mice to make them Type 1 diabetics. You can read in this article where Streptozotocin comes from:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Streptozotocin

..Trevor..
 

Dogster
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 Posted: Tue Jan 7th, 2014 09:34

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Soil microbes-- I had long suspected that was the reason if i get a blast of soil or dirt near my face i immediately get a migraine (meaning within an hour or hours) which usually also then turns into a sinus infection and then lung infection . . . .



____________________
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